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 MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]

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MasonMcK
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PostSubject: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Mon Feb 01, 2016 5:54 pm





I know, I know... it looks VERY complete... Well hold on a few secs and we'll jump down to whats gonna be done



ATLTF 2016 build off:
Name (as of now): Mud Cadet 1600 (or just Cub Cadet 1600)
Platform: 1977 Cub Cadet 1000
Plan:
1) Stock, tired 10 hp small block Kohler K241 replaced with mildly to aggressively built 16 hp big block Kohler K341, with smog pump supercharger
2) Motor mount rail modification
3) New motor mounts
4) Custom exhaust (Front axle dump or dual side exits)
5) Custom intake extension/snorkel
6) Mid West Super Cub Built clutch with 600/800lb spring with Kevlar disc
7) Mid West Super Cub Transmission overdrive gears (Goal: at least 16 mph and good off-road capability)
Cool Extended Hi/low shifter for ease of use
9) Steering column rebuilt, new rod ends
10) Tachometer, boost gauge, and accessory switch panel
11) Off-road lighting (light bar and pods)
12) 18x8-8 Rhox Rxal front tires
13) 26x12.00-12 Kenda Executioner rear tires, on wide rims with small backspacing
14) Traveller 2500lb winch
15) Custom front bumper/grille guard
16) Custom grilles
17) Paint
18) Toolbox
19) Recovery points
20) All new electrical components
21) Possible hood rack
22) Dual batteries
23)   Transmission rebuilt
24)   Auto-locker differential
25)   Horn
26)   Stereo/sound system
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tscustoms
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PostSubject: Very cool    Mon Feb 01, 2016 6:20 pm

Very cool I have built a lot of super mod cub cadets for pulling I have one 1000 like this one and they are a great tractor good luck should be awesome when done
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MasonMcK
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Mon Feb 01, 2016 10:51 pm

Thanks! Got any pics? I'd love to see them. Im always looking for more ideas.
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jonnya
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Tue Feb 02, 2016 1:55 am

What's a smog pump supercharger? I like the sound of it, but have no idea what one is!
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Rockinator
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Tue Feb 02, 2016 6:00 am

This looks awesome for a start! Cant wait to see this come together!
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Tue Feb 02, 2016 11:49 am

Neat wee cub there. How does the Auto-locker work on the diff?
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Creepycrawler
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Tue Feb 02, 2016 1:06 pm

Are you goning with a Detroit or ez locker type racheting locker? thats a great idea if so, and the whole build list sounds badass cant wait to see how it comes out. Ive always heard of smog pump superchargers but Ive never seen anyone get one working correctly. but I saw your skills with your last build so I have faith in ya.
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MasonMcK
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Tue Feb 02, 2016 2:48 pm

Thanks guys.

A smog pump is an emissions control device often found in 80's cars and it is basically a high volume air pump. You can find them at junk yards for $5 and in great shape. You just run a belt from the crank to the smog pump shaft, and then hook it up with either draw thru or blow thru carburation. 

As of now I haven't really looked very far into lockers, but it will be one designed for a smaller automotive axle like a Chrysler 7 1/4" or similar.
I too am hoping that I can get it to work well. I've heard that the most common issue is that they lean out under boost so I'm either going to have to make some sort of additional fuel delivery system to supplement the carb, or I may just make a linkage that pulls the choke butterfly closed a little to richen the ATF mixture as it builds boost.
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STUNTMAN JON
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Tue Feb 02, 2016 2:54 pm

i love the fact that a boost gauge is on the to do list Very Happy LOL this should be sweet
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MasonMcK
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Tue Feb 02, 2016 3:15 pm

Hahaha yeah a boost gauge is a must. I'm shooting for 8-13psi, though I know my top end and con rod can handle more than that. My motor is going to be rev limited to 4000 rpm only because of the stock flywheel, along with that's where my cam builds power. Sadly I won't be getting too much work done on this for the next few weeks, as I just blew the transmission in my Massey so that's gotta be rebuilt first. But at least in the meantime I can talk about what I've got so far for the motor.
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MasonMcK
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Fri Feb 05, 2016 8:07 pm



So I got some work done last night on the bare big block. I chucked both of the new stainless valves in the lathe and trued them up, undercut the heads, milled down the faces .030, swirl polished them, and then cut them at 3 angles. 

I don't have a pic of it rn, but I also polished the camshaft, which btw I got really lucky on... It turns out that someone was inside the motor in the past and had the stock cam welded up and reground. And it is one HUGE cam. It's got almost .400" of lift on both intake and exhaust; 79 degrees of overlap; 285 degrees of exhaust duration, 314 degrees of intake duration. Just for comparison, a stock cam would have .301" exhaust lift, and .308" intake lift; and to be NQS pulling legal, it would have to have a maximum lift of .330". But anyway I got that polished, then refaced the valve seats, cut partial reliefs in the block surface. 





Other than that I've just been cleaning, polishing, and prepping all of the internal parts.


Last edited by MasonMcK on Fri Feb 05, 2016 8:16 pm; edited 2 times in total
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Fri Feb 05, 2016 8:13 pm

Motor is looking great! Valves are looking pristine! This motor should pull pretty good! Whats with the mounting bolts mounted directly to the block? Is that for when you run boost or did it come like that? Just curious as i've never seen it done like that before lol
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MasonMcK
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Fri Feb 05, 2016 8:23 pm

This block was the original short block in my 1976 John Deere 300. About 25 years ago my dad (he owned it before I did) put a brand new short block in it as this old one was already punched .030" over. Also it had a bent exhaust valve cuz the big cam had too much lift and made the valves hit the head. So 25 years later I'm using it to repower my Cub Cadet 1000 into a 1600. Story aside, he took all the parts (head, head bolts, etc) and put them on the new engine. So instead of trying to figure out the right bolt lengths, I just bought a brand new set of grade 8 head studs from MidWest Super Cub, which are actually preferred because they apply a more even pressure than regular head bolts to help prevent blowing head gaskets when under boost or high compression.
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Fri Feb 05, 2016 8:42 pm

Boy, you aint messing around here. I know youll get it done, you do great work. I thought of studs on mine but ditched the idea. just going to use them for the engine mount bolts now instead soon. Keep it up!
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Sun Feb 07, 2016 11:04 am

Thanks! I should have the transmission from my Massey built and out of the shop by next weekend hopefully so then I can really get moving on this project. As soon as the Massey is wheel-able again I'll rip the old motor out of the 1000 and get the few parts off of it that I need. I'll make sure to get some pics of that or maybe even a before video showing it off before I've really touched it.
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Sun Feb 07, 2016 10:46 pm

shinny motors always are a good thing, good luck!
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Mon Feb 08, 2016 6:31 pm

Indeed they are! 

Well since we are getting snow tonight and tomorrow, and the Maseey blew the transmission before I could do much snow wheeling, I decided to slap the tires off of that onto this (mainly cuz the Massey can't use them right now lol) 

Just for the safety, happiness, and wellbeing of any viewers, please do not look directly into the clashing color schemes (red vs yellow) as it can cause severe headaches, nausea, dizziness, blindness and even death. You have been warned, and I will not be held responsible for any personal injury as a result of poor judgment on your part. Lol, onto the pics...









So the rear tires clear but are pretty close to rubbing (about 1/2"). Front left rubs when at full lock, on the steering arm and the front attachment mount bolts. But that's in the narrow position. I can turn them out into the wide position but then the fronts will stick out wider than the rears so i need to get wheel spacers or wider rear rims when it comes time for that. 

An upcoming order of business is paint for this... I need to paint my motor before I can assemble it and install it so I need to order paint soon. I want the motor to be a bright color so it will pop out when you open the hood. So my options right now are:

Option 1) Stock Cub Cadet color scheme, but with gloss black rims, and a Cub Cadet yellow motor instead of the flat black. 

Option 2) everything black bedliner, but with some bright colored accents like wheel hubs, engine, intake parts, shifter, grille, etc. 

Option 3) black frame with all the body parts all the same color, like red, blue, orange, etc with the engine the same color as body. 

Make sure to let me know which one you like the most. It will be a lot of help for me. Also if you have other suggested schemes feel free to mention them too. Thanks. 

Also, I'll try to get a few snow-wheeling pics and maybe a video if I remember.
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Mon Feb 08, 2016 10:37 pm

On the topic of the smog pump, are you going with a blow thru carb setup? I dont know a ton about it but with decent boost i heard something about the gas trying to get forced back out so you need like a adjustable pressure fuel pump, or some different float setup.

Just check out some cars with the setup and see what carb differences there is, just food for thought.
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Tue Feb 09, 2016 1:24 am

Or could you put the supercharger after the carb?
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Tue Feb 09, 2016 1:04 pm

I will be using a draw through system for this. Draw through has the carb before the compressor so the air/fuel mixture is *drawn through* the carb, through the compressor, and into the engine. Benefits to using DT is it requires little to no carb mods, is extremely easy to tune, and holds consistent power all the way through the rev range. Also with lower boost levels you can use a mechanical fuel pump but I wouldn't try gravity feeding it. Some draw backs is that the carb needs to be moved (possible benefit), and custom governor linkages will need to be made, unless I drop a good chunk of money on a billet flywheel and run ungoverned (which opens a whole new can of worms like coming up with an electric cooling system). Other draw backs (or benefits) is that draw through can't support an intercooler, and it doesn't require a blow off valve. Another benefit that I can see, is by relocating the carb, I will no longer be locked into using the Kohler or Walbro carbs. I could use anything from a bunch of string trimmer carbs, to triple K91 carbs, to a two barrel Command carb, or possibly a Carter 30 with a K91 carb. Possibilities are almost endless. Okay I'll admit the string trimmer carbs would be pretty stupid looking and a pain to tune, but who knows it could really pull some power. Maybe 4 push mower carbs would be a lot better looking and easier to tune. But what I mean is draw through really opens up the possibilities for something like this.

Blow through however, requires a lot more to get it to work right. For starters, the carb would stay in the stock position, so I would have no governor linkage issues; but the carb requires extensive mods or it won't run well. It indeed would require a variable pressure electronic fuel pump with a special regulator to adjust the fuel pressure. Also the fuel bowl pressure needs to match the pressure outside of the carb or the float will never work. This is where certain solutions appeared, including one where you completely enclose the carb in a box, and seal it so it will hold the boost. Doesn't look anywhere near as cool as a bare carb. There's a few other things that I can't recall right now that need to be done to the carb, but its way too much work in my opinion. Especially since I will not be running an intercooler. As for tuning a BT system, it is a major pain to get them to hold a tune, and they have low spots throughout the power band and like to stumble in spots during acceleration.
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mr.modified
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Tue Feb 09, 2016 3:02 pm

Do you have a welder so you can make your own manifolds? Just weld up whatever you want. Then you can put things where you need them.
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Tue Feb 09, 2016 4:48 pm

I don't have a welder at my house but I have access to one nearby. We will be welding up manifolds to connect the intake to the smog pump, and then another manifold to adapt the carb(s) to the smog pump. Then another manifold to put the air cleaner up as high as possible inside the hood.

So does anyone have any opinion on the color scheme for this?
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Tue Feb 09, 2016 5:21 pm

How about a white hood, bedlined fenders and yellow rims and motor? I think that would look good
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MasonMcK
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Tue Feb 09, 2016 6:10 pm

What shades of these colors do you mean? Like the Cub Cadet white and yellow, or do you mean a bright white and a brighter yellow more like the John Deere yellow? How about the color of the frame and chassis? 

I'm just trying to envision exactly what you mean. Thanks!
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PostSubject: Re: MasonMcK's Off-road/Mudding Cub Cadet [2016 Build-Off Entry]   Tue Feb 09, 2016 7:19 pm

On the topic of throttle linkage, although it is personal preference, i love the ungovenered setup a lot more, makes me feel more in tune/ control of the machine. It complements the steering, tuned in clutch, pulley swap, ect.
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