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 Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up

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mowerjunkie03
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Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeSat Apr 06, 2019 11:47 am

I am so glad I stumbled apon this thread. From what little footage I have seen of this tractor I am super impressed. It's great to see a Cub hittin the trails with the rest of them. This build reminded me that you don't need a Wheelhorse or a Sears to make a great trail rig so that inspired me to start work on my Bolens 1050 again.

Some questions I have are you running the stock clutch? And is it tough enough to take all that power and abuse? Did you increase the gearing? I have seen blueprints for a custom driveshaft and clutch design for Cubs designed for pullers and I have wondered if that is necessary for offroading. Sorry about all the questions. I am not that knowledgeable about Cub Cadets. Thanks.
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Mister_Studabaker
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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeSat Apr 06, 2019 12:39 pm

@mowerjunkie03 Thank you glad you found Keizer impressive.  Please ask all the questions you wish it is absolutely no problem.  My answers tend to be way overboard so my apologies in advance.

It depends if you like to clutch dump and do wheelies than no way will stock hold even on stock 16hp trim.  Keizer's clutch has been designed to handle just that "Wheelies in top gear and motor cranked" so far 24hp, 27" tires and 47% overdrive gear setup and still holding.  It is a two stage engagement with two disks that delivers lower clutch pressure and adds feel to the mix.  Was able to make it on the cheap as well.  

Pulling the motor in and out all the time with cubs stock drive line set made for challenging installs and removals. Something had to change so the drive shaft was modded to help with that.  Installed a constant velocity joint from a newer cub which had the bigger diameter drive shaft too, perfect for what was about to happen to it.  "Big RPM clutch drops"

Woods running a good clutch is needed to help clear out your tires to either get out or go deeper or to bounce over a log.  When you have inches to a foot to get the "get out jail free card" there is no room for clutch slippage.  Found this out the hard way missed dinner and got laughed at.  Still funny today.  Wrote up a little story about that on FaceBook's Cleetus joe along with other mods done to Keizer.

Pulling clutches are way to pricey that require major spring pressure to hold them and they have no feel.  No thanks.  Cheap strong and holds a ton literally with little pedal effort.

Best Regards,
Mister Studabaker
PS thank you for your interest and stay tuned lots more content coming this way.
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mowerjunkie03
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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeSat Apr 06, 2019 9:20 pm

Wow thanks for the response. I am glad to see this whole new level of professionalism brought to the mower modding community. I hope to some day have the knowledge and skill tk innovate on this level.

I this clutch design something that could be used on other GTs with sprockets and chain do away with slippage?
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Mister_Studabaker
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Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 07, 2019 6:47 am

@mowerjunkie03 Just by asking questions puts you well on your way.

Ok at a loss here and need your view to see if the clutch can be retrofitted for your use.  Space constraints for the cub setup roughly 15"x12".
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20143

By changing orientation one could put a driven double pulley or sprocket in there somewhere.  What do you think?  Double pulley would stop most of the belt slippage plus you could add more tension to the belts.  That's it love your question, you have earned the question of the week, congratulations job well done.  

Best Regards,
Mister Studabaker
Stay tuned lots more stuff heading this way.
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prancstaman
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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeTue Apr 09, 2019 10:03 pm

That's a neat clutch there. It never occurred to me to put the clutch spring on the shaft like that. Very slick. What part on the clutch did you modify?
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Cheesedawg82
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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeWed Apr 10, 2019 2:21 pm

Seems as if a few folks are confused here, talking about belts and the clutch on a narrow frame Cub Cadet. These machines aren't like what most of you have been working on, they're a genuine miniature farm tractor, with a direct shaft drive, gear box, and rear end borrowed from the Farmall Cub. When this tractor was new on the lot in the '60s, it was priced higher than some cars.
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Mister_Studabaker
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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeWed Apr 10, 2019 6:55 pm

@prancstaman Its better to list what is left stock, Its a shorter list Wink Pressure plates, release arm, draw bar and the lighter colored clutch disk. The goal is to see if this can hold 30hp.

Stay tuned

Best Regards,
Mister Studabaker
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Mister_Studabaker
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Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeWed Apr 10, 2019 7:30 pm

Super light weight retainers have a lip that is a little to big to let the spring sit and stabilize itself.

Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20148

Made a lathe tool to help in the matter.  Spring now has a stable perch.


Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20149

Exhaust valve prep is complete.  Keeper grove cut, stem narrowed next swirl polish.

Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20150

Intake was going to be done today but uh... um... hahaha I thought all along that the big ole intake head would fit inside the chuck and tail stock so went and cut the end off to set the seat height a few days ago. Well assumption kicked my ass again.  The head is to big to fit inside the chuck.  Need to clamp on the stem with head inside lathe "sh*t".  Getting good a cutting up valves takes a few or a lot in my case Wink

Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20151

Speed secret shhh! Dont tell anyone its just between you and I K.  If you gotta use JB Weld in your intake use layers the stuff shrinks a little bit.  

Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20152

Final layer.  Next step form with die grinder and 1/4 diamond cut burr.  Behind all that stuff is a crazy huge valve insert with a huge step.  Now its going to be very smooth flowing, you'll see...Cause ima gonna show you another Speed Secret.  So mums the word, what ever that means.


Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20153


Stay tuned lots more content. Going to cover the Creeper gear box soon.

Best Regards,
Mister Studabaker
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AllisKidD21
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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeWed Apr 10, 2019 7:34 pm

Very beautiful work! This is gonna be one MAD Kohler. Twisted Evil

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diddie
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Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeWed Apr 10, 2019 10:08 pm

@prancstaman wrote:
That's a neat clutch there. It never occurred to me to put the clutch spring on the shaft like that. Very slick. What part on the clutch did you modify?
cub cadet has always used this design for there manual trans tractors with the spring on the shaft to put the pressure on the pressure plate he didn't create that set up.
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prancstaman
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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeThu Apr 11, 2019 8:24 pm

@diddie wrote:
@prancstaman wrote:
That's a neat clutch there. It never occurred to me to put the clutch spring on the shaft like that. Very slick. What part on the clutch did you modify?
cub cadet has always used this design for there manual trans tractors with the spring on the shaft to put the pressure on the pressure plate he didn't create that set up.

Yes, stock setup. I never really seen one though. I'm use to seeing and working on car/truck clutch.
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mowerjunkie03
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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeFri Apr 12, 2019 3:17 pm

@diddie wrote:
@prancstaman wrote:
That's a neat clutch there. It never occurred to me to put the clutch spring on the shaft like that. Very slick. What part on the clutch did you modify?
cub cadet has always used this design for there manual trans tractors with the spring on the shaft to put the pressure on the pressure plate he didn't create that set up.

Bolens has always used this technique as well. This looks alot like a simplified version of the clutch on my Bolens 1050.
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TheBeal
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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 14, 2019 9:39 am

I like to see the engine work. Makes me want to do something to my K341. scratch
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Mister_Studabaker
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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 14, 2019 3:45 pm

Side view of port work of intake:

Before: Notice the large wall.  This is behind valve stem that will be filled in.  
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20157

After:  Trying to induce more flow to the left side of this port, hence hump before valve stem hole. Can you see the slight rise midway up on the right side?
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20156

Top view of same port
Before:
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20159

After:  Form is set going to leave this rough for now.  After an hour or so of motor testing will look to see how things are.
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20158

Retainer work.  Spring perch is a little to big.  Made a tool for the lathe work to reduce the step size.  

Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20160

Tool used and spring now sitting comfortably on retainer.  This reduces spring harmonics.  

Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20161

Keeper groove cut into exhaust valve.  Installed into motor to measure spring height, turns out this is a little short.  No worries here knew it was short going in.  This valve was for setting the seat height and was a dummy from the get go and tried to fix it.
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20162

Intake:  Found that the head is to big to fit into the lathe chuck for keeper groove install.  So first thing first.  Cut the keeper groove first while there is a little more stem to work with, then shorten and clean up all angles to look like the one shown below.
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20163
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Mister_Studabaker
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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 14, 2019 4:03 pm

@TheBeal wrote:
I like to see the engine work. Makes me want to do something to my K341. scratch

Me too.  There is a glitch.  Doing a modification to the constant velocity joint base flange and input pinion of the creeper gear.  The taper and out of round condition that now exist is beyond what retaining compound can cure.  I.e. last install left the compound out now it's time to repair.
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Mister_Studabaker
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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeMon Apr 15, 2019 10:18 am

Creeper gear main shaft set up in lathe.  Going to remove the taper and out of round condition. Hole size is on outer edge is .254 and middle .251.  This going to reamed to .2535.  There is a case on the outside so leaving that alone.

Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20166

When new the input pinion was .625.  Now .607.  Time to make the base flange.
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20168


Constant velocity joint and base flange.  The base flange inside id is all over the place.  Going to make a new one out of 4340 pre hard to 25hrc should be double the strength of original.
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20167

Saw is taking its sweet %$# time cutting through.  Wonder if this is a sign of things to come during lathe work.
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20169

Lathe work completed: Carbide inserts did a nice job whittling this down.

Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20170

Seeings how this is a stronger material took a few moments to lighten this up.

Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20171

Set up on mill for drill and tap:
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20172

Good news is roll pin hole is drilled and reamed.  Bad news the ream went way oversize.  So rotate 90°and do over again.  This time 200rpm instead of 700rpm and ordered .2535 ream to match what hole size to input pinion on creeper gear main shaft.  Ream is due to show today.4.15.2019
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20173
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mowerjunkie03
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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeTue Apr 16, 2019 10:41 pm

This is some beautiful machine work. Good thinking with the JB weld on the intake. Turned out great! Do you have YouTube?
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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeWed Apr 17, 2019 7:23 am

To cub owners - note the "roll pin" hole.

IH used Spirol, or roll pins. This is a pin that's a small coil of steel, made up like grandma's pumpkin rolls. Don't confuse it with a standard split pin. While they look every similar, they're not the same, and they're not nearly as strong. A split pin is much more likely to shear.
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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeWed Apr 17, 2019 7:53 pm

@mowerjunkie03 wrote:
This is some beautiful machine work. Good thinking with the JB weld on the intake. Turned out great! Do you have YouTube?

Thank you trying my best.

JB weld was used previously in the same port and applied it all in one shot, not a good idea, second times the charm with multiple layers maybe.

Youtube handle is: Mr Studabaker or try a search for cub cadet mud mower.

Stay tuned more to come.

Mister_Studabaker
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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeWed Apr 17, 2019 8:13 pm

Lathe all set up for cutting keeper groove.
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20175

Close up.  Just enough valve to stem for collet to squeeze onto.

Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20177

Valves are now swirl polished.
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20178

Used cut off wheel to trim stems down to close and then square them up using a 5/16 drill bushing and stone.  Let me tell those suckers are hard.
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20179
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20180

Regards,
Mister_Studabaker  

Stay tuned
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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeTue Apr 23, 2019 5:44 pm

Uh Oh! after some hours of trying to adjust the clutch found some interesting issues.  Cub Cadet engineers shorted the cross brace by about an inch on each side.
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20192
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20191



So this is what happens when big front tires and and longer axle arms meet the cub frame metal becomes bent and stretched.  Look at the square edge where its touching the frame.  The frame is supposed to be flat.
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20181

Close up.
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20182

After some thought and a few barley soda pops several ideas showed up the night before.  This morning thought through each idea none sounded good.  Going to try the simple route first.

Going to use this piece of scrap and turn it into a left and right frame to axle bracket support.
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20184

Chop the pins off and off to clearance the pc's for the oil pan.
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20186
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20185

Oil pan clears and associated boss too, ready for weld  
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20187

Welded and cold galvanized.  One of these days a good looking weld is going to happen.
Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20188
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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeThu Apr 25, 2019 8:38 pm

A little walk around.



Test hill lugging and full throttle on second pass.
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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeThu Apr 25, 2019 9:01 pm

Gotta love that low end grunt! She sounds great!

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"This'll either wake you up or put you to sleep forever!"- Red Green         "Whatever you do you should do right, even if it's something wrong." - Hank Hill
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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeThu Apr 25, 2019 9:51 pm

Some of those hillclimbs looked like they might have hurt on all that heavy iron. What kind of seat do you have on her? My 149 could use an upgrade, as garden season is upon us.

Awesome machine, she sounds great!

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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeFri Apr 26, 2019 6:51 pm

@Cheesedawg82  Standard seat added taller springs and beefed up the seat tray.  The big bonus is running the tire pressure around 2psi which makes for a nice ride.

Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20194


Played a hunch today.  When the old exhaust valve came out the stem had signs of back pressure.  Hmm wonder if the muffler is slowing things down.  Soo... today was all about tearing the exhaust down to look at the muffler.  Turns out very restricted.  Somewhere along the way a bigger muffler was acquired.  Compared the old to the new one and well...see picture...  Bonus Keizer now has cool quiet sounding exhaust note with power down low and a power band hit up high.  Hunch confirmed and paid.  


Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Wp_20193

Do you guys want to see a formal walk around of all the stuff that has been done up this point?

Regards,
Mister_Studabaker

P.S. @AllisKidD21  The exhaust note is even better at a much lower tone.
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PostSubject: Re: Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up   Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Icon_minitimeFri Apr 26, 2019 7:06 pm

@Mister_Studabaker wrote:


P.S. @AllisKidD21  The exhaust note is even better at a much lower tone.[/size]

Ooo boy, I can only imagine!

Also I think a walk around video would be great!

_______________________________________________
"This'll either wake you up or put you to sleep forever!"- Red Green         "Whatever you do you should do right, even if it's something wrong." - Hank Hill
       - MTD Off-Road Build     
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Keizer the Little Cub Cadet 122 is growing up - Page 2 Empty
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