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 17 hp intek hard to start...yep

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Mikethepigman
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PostSubject: 17 hp intek hard to start...yep   17 hp intek hard to start...yep Icon_minitimeTue Feb 28, 2017 8:40 pm

Well the engine is hard to roll over the hill, I check the valves and the cam is good cause it moves the intake valve slightly on the release. I've watched just about every YouTube video out there. I've set the valves every where from .003 to .006. both the intake and exhaust. Still hard to get over the hill. Swapped starters, battery's. Still hard to get over the hill. Hooked up two good battery. Checked the flywheel key.. good there. Cleaned flywheel and coil, set to .012 gap, great spark. It rolls over so nice with no plug. But rolls over so hard with it in. Finally fed up I started just turning things by hand(value adjustments) and what I got is a backfire.. on starting fluid. So pulled the head, cleaned head and reseat the valves. Cleaned top of piston from build up. Reassembled and still hard to roll over. For giggles I pushed the intake valve in slightly and what do ya know it rolls over easier now. However won't start and I'm sure the intake valve is slightly open. Yes I pushed the rocker and spring in and then tighten it up. For giggles. So my question is what the heck does that mean and how the heck do I fix it???? I have a 17.5 intek and really thinking of doing a head swap and see if that helps idk.. any and all help would greatly be appreciated!! Thanks 17 hp intek hard to start...yep 2429134702
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CraftsmanQuad19
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PostSubject: Re: 17 hp intek hard to start...yep   17 hp intek hard to start...yep Icon_minitimeTue Feb 28, 2017 9:08 pm

Sounds like a plugged compression release (or does the intake valve do that?) My 14.5 on my ace does the same thing and I *think* it is a bad solenoid. Check all your grounds and connections because it just sounds like you have really good compression
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Mikethepigman
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PostSubject: Re: 17 hp intek hard to start...yep   17 hp intek hard to start...yep Icon_minitimeTue Feb 28, 2017 9:16 pm

Yes definitely have good compression. I've even tried to jump start right off starter and bypass everything and still hard to start. Yes the compression release on the cam and intake are good cause when I spin flywheel by hand i can see a small movement in valve. Well the YouTube video i seen says that's how ya check it. I'm stumped bub lol
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CraftsmanQuad19
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PostSubject: Re: 17 hp intek hard to start...yep   17 hp intek hard to start...yep Icon_minitimeTue Feb 28, 2017 9:21 pm

Does it run good otherwise?
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Mikethepigman
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PostSubject: Re: 17 hp intek hard to start...yep   17 hp intek hard to start...yep Icon_minitimeTue Feb 28, 2017 9:25 pm

Won't start. Never had it running. It's a used unit. Got it as is. So checked oil, took off carb, hit it with starting fluid and went to start and it rolled over really hard, I said ok and started trouble shooting it. Done just about every thing I know how.but never got to start and only backfire.
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PostSubject: Re: 17 hp intek hard to start...yep   17 hp intek hard to start...yep Icon_minitimeTue Feb 28, 2017 9:29 pm

Only thing I can think of are valves not adjusted right or your timing is off, but you already checked that. Have you been through the carb? I suppose it COULD be fuel related....
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tater195
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PostSubject: Re: 17 hp intek hard to start...yep   17 hp intek hard to start...yep Icon_minitimeTue Feb 28, 2017 9:46 pm

My guess would be bent push rod, flat cam, worn rocker or bent valve.
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tater195
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PostSubject: Re: 17 hp intek hard to start...yep   17 hp intek hard to start...yep Icon_minitimeTue Feb 28, 2017 9:46 pm

forgot to add this.. loose valve seat
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Mikethepigman
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PostSubject: Re: 17 hp intek hard to start...yep   17 hp intek hard to start...yep Icon_minitimeTue Feb 28, 2017 9:48 pm

Yes cleaned carb already, actually was in good shape. I've adjusted the valves to spec and still nothing, reseated valves etc etc etc. I did not check timming or not sure how to. I did check the fly wheel key and nothing wrong there. How would one check timming on that??
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tater195
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PostSubject: Re: 17 hp intek hard to start...yep   17 hp intek hard to start...yep Icon_minitimeTue Feb 28, 2017 9:51 pm

sounds like you have a problem on the intake valve. You may have adjusted it to spec, but there could be other issues.
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Mikethepigman
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PostSubject: Re: 17 hp intek hard to start...yep   17 hp intek hard to start...yep Icon_minitimeTue Feb 28, 2017 9:54 pm

I agree that it is the intake side. I do hear noise's when the stroke reaches the intake side. Like it's sucking alot or something. Let ask this.. if it's the intake side, would I be able to take parts off a 17.5 intek and use on my 17 intek??
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tater195
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PostSubject: Re: 17 hp intek hard to start...yep   17 hp intek hard to start...yep Icon_minitimeTue Feb 28, 2017 9:58 pm

If it is a bent push rod or valve.. probably yes, assuming the donor parts are better than the ones you are replacing
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tater195
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PostSubject: Re: 17 hp intek hard to start...yep   17 hp intek hard to start...yep Icon_minitimeTue Feb 28, 2017 10:02 pm

I have not priced an upper end quick fix on these lately, but I think you can get the valves, push rods and vc gasket for under $40
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Mikethepigman
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PostSubject: Re: 17 hp intek hard to start...yep   17 hp intek hard to start...yep Icon_minitimeTue Feb 28, 2017 10:03 pm

Yea not sure of the parts are better but definitely a different variable to test and hopefully get different results. Besides the obvious of looking and feeling, how would I go about seeing if it's bent? I did look at them when I had everything apart and clean and reseated. However I didn't notice any bends or chips scratches or any obvious defects. Could it be bent to the point of no good and yet not visible to the eye?? I rolled it on a flat surface and didn't see any difference. Idk
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tater195
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PostSubject: Re: 17 hp intek hard to start...yep   17 hp intek hard to start...yep Icon_minitimeTue Feb 28, 2017 10:24 pm

All the old timers say roll it on glass. Now a days everyone has granite counter tops. Find some thing flat and roll it (valves or push rods), if the ends come up, throw it out
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Mikethepigman
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PostSubject: Re: 17 hp intek hard to start...yep   17 hp intek hard to start...yep Icon_minitimeTue Feb 28, 2017 10:29 pm

I will definitely check all that and make sure. I did not know that. Thank you for the info.
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prancstaman
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PostSubject: Re: 17 hp intek hard to start...yep   17 hp intek hard to start...yep Icon_minitimeWed Mar 01, 2017 7:40 pm

To Check the timing of the cam, valves, flywheel, to the piston is simple. Pull the spark plug and stick a screw driver down the hole so it touching the piston to feel it's movement up and down, if that is possible. If not then just put your finger over the spark plug hole to feel the suction and compression. Next pull the valve cover ( just one will due) and the shroud for flywheel. Next, spin motor by hand clockwise (direction of engine running) and feel the cycles with screwdriver or finger, watching the flywheel magnet when it crosses over the magneto and also watching the valves when they open and close. You can move really slow and still be able to see and feel what is going on. Note the key position on the crank in relation to flywheel, usually the key is TDC or close to it for one of the cylinders.

You checking the valves and push rods, if you can't see anything wrong then nothing is wrong. Try not to over think anything. Everything is as simple as it appears.

OK, As far as what the symptoms are, could be one of 2 things. Weak starter or the compression release on startup is bad. You can pull the starter and test it by free spinning it. If it's bad you will know it by it growling when spinning but if good then will be spinning fast and can tell that by it's sound. Nothing hidden here.
Second part, the compression release. Just about every engine has them these days because of the high compression of the motors and the starters have a hard time cranking the engine over so the engineers dump the compression on startup to make it easier to spin and get the compression back when the engine catches a fire starting up. These systems are simple at best and will wear out, making it hard to crank. Look at this setup again and confirm that the compression is being dumped. The valve you said seen moving might not be enough to dump the compression on startup. Need to figure out how it actually works and find the worn out part. Sorry I am not familiar with this kind of engine but I do know the basics of them. Maybe this will give a little direction to your problem.
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Mikethepigman
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PostSubject: Re: 17 hp intek hard to start...yep   17 hp intek hard to start...yep Icon_minitimeWed Mar 01, 2017 8:01 pm

Yea I pulled plug and did the screwdriver trick to set the valves, well try.. it has alot of compression. I thought by cleaning the build up off the piston top and the inside of head that it would help.. and it did not. I did not check the flywheel magneto position and flywheel key yet. When you say dump compression to start, it definitely is not doing that. I've swapped out starters and even used two batteries to make sure all of that was good. And of course today it's been raining all day when I got home so my donor engine is outside and I can't get to my parts. A worn out cam is sounding a bit more likely. I really hoping that my donor engine will work for parts. It's a 17.5 intek single cylinder and the other is a 17 intek. I would guess maybe everything is the same except maybe stroke or bore size?? I had a 14.5 b&s that was hard to roll over, drained whatever oil substance that was in it. Put new oil in and it fired right up. Already changed the oil on this 17 intek. Just sucks knowing that I'm probably gonna have to pull engine and swap out cams. Kind wanna keep it all original cause it's in a JD L100 and I wanna sell for a profit. Plus I want to know what the heck has me stumped lol if I can't figure this out then be watching for a 20hp kohler opposed twin swap lol. Thank you for all the great knowledge!!
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prancstaman
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PostSubject: Re: 17 hp intek hard to start...yep   17 hp intek hard to start...yep Icon_minitimeWed Mar 01, 2017 9:11 pm

No problem and good luck.
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PostSubject: Re: 17 hp intek hard to start...yep   17 hp intek hard to start...yep Icon_minitime

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