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 Rear suspension idea

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dagr8tim
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PostSubject: Rear suspension idea   Rear suspension idea Icon_minitimeMon Jan 09, 2012 11:01 am

I know fearless front had some issues and gave up on this. But what do you think about this. Using an old rim as a transaxle pulley. Basically the rim would act like a drum and the belt could move up and down the flat inner surface of the rim as the rear transaxle articulated.

The only real issue I see is that a rim would probably be smaller than the transaxle pulley and may cause issues with the gear ratio between the pulleys.
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Jamus
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PostSubject: Re: Rear suspension idea   Rear suspension idea Icon_minitimeMon Jan 09, 2012 12:22 pm

The sides of the pulley are what grip the belt isn't it? I would expect our proposed setup to just slip. Not that I'm against the idea, my end goal is to have both front and rear suspension on my tractor. Rear suspension is the most difficult to figure out. I can onl think of 2 solutions, chain drive to a swingarm solid axle, or chain drive to a jackshaft(or center diff) with independent suspension running from that. Neither of those seem too easy and would add length to the tractor.
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dagr8tim
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PostSubject: Re: Rear suspension idea   Rear suspension idea Icon_minitimeMon Jan 09, 2012 12:26 pm

@Jamus wrote:
The sides of the pulley are what grip the belt isn't it? I would expect our proposed setup to just slip. Not that I'm against the idea, my end goal is to have both front and rear suspension on my tractor. Rear suspension is the most difficult to figure out. I can onl think of 2 solutions, chain drive to a swingarm solid axle, or chain drive to a jackshaft(or center diff) with independent suspension running from that. Neither of those seem too easy and would add length to the tractor.

You are right. I was just wondering why nobody had tried it. I figured either it sucks or was otherwise too far out there.

Being as you mentioned independent rear suspension, here's something else. My parts Jeep Cherokee had a small universal joint at the steering column. I wonder if it would be possible to get afew more of these and basically do like a CV style axle shift for each side. Then the center section could be fixed. It would involve MASSIVE modifications to the transaxle case.

A swing arm setup is most likely the simplest solution.
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redneckcarrow
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PostSubject: Re: Rear suspension idea   Rear suspension idea Icon_minitimeMon Jan 09, 2012 5:15 pm

been thinking the same idea cut the axle after it comes out of the case leave enough axel for a ujont if any one has ever seen the rear suspension of an old vw beetle that is what i was thinking yes it prob would make tractor wider but that wouldnt be a bad thing more stable

ps hopping to start my build in spring
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Jamus
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PostSubject: Re: Rear suspension idea   Rear suspension idea Icon_minitimeMon Jan 09, 2012 5:42 pm

Maybe switch to a peerless 700 for a more narrow transaxle. Not sure if the steering shafts would be strong enough or not. I know the Cherokees have good shafts though, no stupid rag joints. I have used the jeeps and also chevy astro mini van shafts to swap into trucks I've built over the years. I can't stand slop in the steering wheel.
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dagr8tim
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PostSubject: Re: Rear suspension idea   Rear suspension idea Icon_minitimeMon Jan 09, 2012 6:18 pm

@Jamus wrote:
Maybe switch to a peerless 700 for a more narrow transaxle. Not sure if the steering shafts would be strong enough or not. I know the Cherokees have good shafts though, no stupid rag joints. I have used the jeeps and also chevy astro mini van shafts to swap into trucks I've built over the years. I can't stand slop in the steering wheel.

You're talking my language. I've got a 700 in a RER, and I'll be getting another RER that should have a 700 in ut. I've also got a 98 Cherokee that I bought as parts for my 97. I'm considering cutting the axle shafts down and mounting the hubs on the tractor to convert to a 5 on 4.5 lug pattern.

Another idea may be to get the hubs and stub shafts from a Dana 30, and use that on the rear of a tractor for independent rear suspension.
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PostSubject: Rear suspension idea   Rear suspension idea Icon_minitimeMon Jan 09, 2012 7:08 pm

If you want to dump a lot of money in one, get an old cub cadet ( not the Made To Die crap) heavy duty rearend. they will accept mustangII 3rd members. I think the spine count on fiesta axles will fit. just need to fab plates and pull the old axle housings.
newer independent atv rear axles would work too, but you would have to rotate the rearend 90deg and change the drive line to a pulley input. might work for a lifted mower, cant see all of that fitting under the seat.
it looks like thats what they did on the stabil tractor. But I think the budget was about 10k on that one


Unless you just have a lot of time and money on your hands or know of some off road tractor racing circuit that pays real good, this just sounds like some thing to put on the wish list and forget about
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dagr8tim
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PostSubject: Re: Rear suspension idea   Rear suspension idea Icon_minitimeMon Jan 09, 2012 7:32 pm

rat88 wrote:
Unless you just have a lot of time and money on your hands or know of some off road tractor racing circuit that pays real good, this just sounds like some thing to put on the wish list and forget about

While I agree with you to a point. You're never going to progress unless you try to think in new ways.
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W1ldyOvvnZ
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PostSubject: Re: Rear suspension idea   Rear suspension idea Icon_minitimeFri Jan 20, 2012 11:44 pm

couldn't you mount a pulley and put a CV joint(from an ATV possibly) then make something so the shaft from the pulley to the transmission can move up and down with the suspension(Like two splined pieces that fit onto each other and can move freely in and out). and maybe put old leaf spring suspension off of the front of a Snowmobile? I think that could work but you would have to have boots over the CV joints and the splined pieces so it would sort of suck if you get a lot of water in it
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dagr8tim
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PostSubject: Re: Rear suspension idea   Rear suspension idea Icon_minitimeSat Jan 21, 2012 1:11 am

@w1ldyovvnz wrote:
couldn't you mount a pulley and put a CV joint(from an ATV possibly) then make something so the shaft from the pulley to the transmission can move up and down with the suspension(Like two splined pieces that fit onto each other and can move freely in and out). and maybe put old leaf spring suspension off of the front of a Snowmobile? I think that could work but you would have to have boots over the CV joints and the splined pieces so it would sort of suck if you get a lot of water in it

Yeah, I was thinking that too.
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dangeroustoys56
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PostSubject: Re: Rear suspension idea   Rear suspension idea Icon_minitimeSat Jan 21, 2012 8:53 am

The rim as pulley probably wouldnt work - the closest thing to that would a MTD variable drive pulley - the belt rides up and down the pulley - but is gripped by the assembly.

Easiest would be a 700 peerless or RAGB to a swing arm - not independent, but flexes. The tinkering with that would be coil over spring rates.

All of it depends on where youd be taking the tractor tho- remember, more points to flex could mean more points to break .

Another thing is the tractor - if its to be more ATV type, then the whole thing needs to be re thought. ATV's have thier motor in the middle, tractors dont - if the chassis was redone to be setup , then the independent setups would be easier to make .

Other then ATV parts, small front drive car parts could work - for the CV joints and hubs.

Again- depends on what your budget and imagination can come up with.
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redzz02
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PostSubject: Re: Rear suspension idea   Rear suspension idea Icon_minitimeSat Jan 21, 2012 9:08 am

I figured out how to put rear suspension with lead springs from a rrailer on the old granny's that have the input on the side, you would just need to figure it how to support the front of the tranny housing so it could still flex
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dagr8tim
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PostSubject: Re: Rear suspension idea   Rear suspension idea Icon_minitimeSat Jan 21, 2012 11:49 am

I've been playing with the idea of using a rear engine rider for this (since I have 2). Because the engine basically sits above the transaxle, cut the frame in front of the engine and make it a swing arm. Then mount an A frame between the two sections with ATV coil over's being the rear legs of the A Frame.

Something like that would be great in the mud/sand. It'e be just like a beetle that had a rear engine and all the weight over the transaxle for traction.
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W1ldyOvvnZ
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PostSubject: Re: Rear suspension idea   Rear suspension idea Icon_minitimeSat Jan 21, 2012 4:41 pm

@redzz02 wrote:
I figured out how to put rear suspension with lead springs from a rrailer on the old granny's that have the input on the side, you would just need to figure it how to support the front of the tranny housing so it could still flex
The only thing is you would need a CV joint or something still, the trans can be on a 15degree angle and maybe the belt would slip off.
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redzz02
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PostSubject: Re: Rear suspension idea   Rear suspension idea Icon_minitimeSat Jan 21, 2012 6:39 pm

No you wouldn't you create a jacks shaft and from the hacks haft to the tranny a tensioner pulley and make a lot of belt gaurds the leaf springs won't flex that much and if they do, you create bump stops so it doesn't flex too much
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dked41
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PostSubject: Re: Rear suspension idea   Rear suspension idea Icon_minitimeTue Jan 31, 2012 12:04 pm

Would a hydraulic driven Case lawn tractor diff work for articulating the drive? No belts just hydraulic hoses.
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