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 Project 4x4x4

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B440
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PostSubject: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeTue Jun 10, 2014 10:30 am

I finally picked up a complete Craftsman LT4000 with AWS.
Project 4x4x4 IMG_1879_zps6dc993bf

Project 4x4x4 IMG_1880_zps40c92dd9

I feel this was a better platform to use than the Noma tractor because of small differences:

Noma;
Brittle plastic fender
12 hp single flathead engine.
Hood has that futuristic pointy nose (I think it's ugly)

LT4000;
metal fender
15hp opposed flathead twin
Hood is still kind of ugly, but looks more like a tractor hood.

This is the start of the 4-wheel drive with 4-wheel steering project (a.k.a. 4x4x4, just like the Bigfoot Monster Truck).

More to come.  cheers


Last edited by B440 on Tue Jun 10, 2014 12:23 pm; edited 1 time in total
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redlinemotorsportts
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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeTue Jun 10, 2014 11:21 am

I'm happy that you finally found another axle. They are crazy hard to find. Looking forward to this project.

_______________________________________________
Check out my builds!: MTD "Rock Bouncing" Mower -------- 60's Springfeild V-twin Mini Speed Tractor : SOLD!
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B440
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Join date : 2014-01-22
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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeTue Jun 10, 2014 12:31 pm

They're not too hard to find if you know what you're looking for. There's a Noma tractor for $300 and another LT4000 AWS for $425 on CL in my area right now. There was also a Noma parts tractor for $75 a little while back, but it was missing the rear wheels.

The mythical Unicorn of rear wheel steering axles for me, is the MTD FNR with 4-lugs, which one of our members, Angchor has acquired.

There's a John Deere LX277 AWS on CL for $500 and it looks like a runner with a snow blade setup, but no deck. I think that would be a nice machine to tinker with, but I chose the LT4000 because it was cheaper and I already had one identical axle for the project.
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1997 Murray
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1997 Murray

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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeTue Jun 10, 2014 12:35 pm

funny thing, but I could get a 4ws for free with a blown engine from a guy at church- but my dad dosen't think i should have another one. also, dangeroustoys56 has a 4ws mtd, but he hasn't been on here since 2011.
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Angchor
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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeTue Jun 10, 2014 4:24 pm

@1997 Murray wrote:
funny thing, but I could get a 4ws for free with a blown engine from a guy at church- but my dad dosen't think i should have another one. also, dangeroustoys56 has a 4ws mtd, but he hasn't been on here since 2011.

Where are you located?

I was given mine by a fellow member of my church, as well.
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1997 Murray
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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeTue Jun 10, 2014 4:26 pm

deming, wa. just up the road from you.Project 4x4x4 Icon_biggrin
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Angchor
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Angchor

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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeTue Jun 10, 2014 4:34 pm

@1997 Murray wrote:
deming, wa. just up the road from you.Project 4x4x4 Icon_biggrin

Quite a ways up the road! LOL

If you had been closer I would have suggested that you get it and bring it over and find a work space.
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B440
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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeSat Jun 14, 2014 3:17 pm

I had some time to play around with this machine.
Project 4x4x4 IMG_1896_zpscafa46eb

Project 4x4x4 IMG_1897_zps4502d4b4

My initial impressions:
Steering around trees/trails is great! If you can get the front tires around the tree, the rear end will follow. It does not want to "return center" though. Once you start turning, it wants to go full lock and you have to really pull on the wheel to get centered again. Certainly needs attention there. Someone had previously messed with the front steering geometry and caused the fronts to "push" and prematurely wear them out.

The opposed twin is nice, and sounds better than a single at idle, but seems to use up fuel quickly. I do have a B&S V-twin saved and I'll likely use it. Some of the Noma models came with a Vanguard V-twin, so the mounting holes may just line up.

The seat is too low. I've gotten used to a higher viewpoint on my other machines. Need to raise the seat maybe 2 inches.

The shifting is nice and easy. The belt configuration sucks; typical 3-pulley design that is made to slip. Also needs a little more speed. Maybe just put a 4" or 5" on the driveshaft.

Mud; This will be a problem. Only 2" of the rear tires are covered by the fender. And as the wheel turns, it throws mud in that direction, which will be all over my legs and the hood! I may have to implement some type of fender that moves with the tire, like on some gokarts I've seen.

I definitely want to put a plow on this one, but that'll be after all the bugs are worked out.
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B440
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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeSat Jun 14, 2014 9:51 pm

Ok so I may be hoarding, a little bit Shocked 
Project 4x4x4 IMG_1899_zpsbd766ed0

I picked this one up from ebay, sight-unseen. Scotts Turf Master with a 12.5hp B&S flathead. And it even runs!

Project 4x4x4 IMG_1900_zpsac49d1ae

This one is going to need work on the rear steering; It "crab walks" after turning. Something is very worn out in the linkage.
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redlinemotorsportts
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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeSat Jun 14, 2014 10:21 pm

Dooood- my goodness! I think ive lost track! I think this has turned into a 4x4x4x4x4... or sooner or later it will. Bahaha, that flat head is a great engine.

_______________________________________________
Check out my builds!: MTD "Rock Bouncing" Mower -------- 60's Springfeild V-twin Mini Speed Tractor : SOLD!
Project 4x4x4 Screen17
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Last edited by redlinemotorsportts on Sat Jun 14, 2014 10:44 pm; edited 1 time in total
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B440
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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeSat Jun 14, 2014 10:29 pm

@redlinemotorsportts wrote:
Dooood- my goodness? I think ive lost track! I think this has turned into a 4x4x4x4x4... or sooner or later it will. Bahaha, that flat head is a great engine.

lol. Yeah I think I have more than enough parts now. I may even have enough to continue the project, and fix up the Turf Master into a like-new lawn cutter. The only thing I don't have enough of.... is time to work on it.

What would you make with four steerable axles?
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redlinemotorsportts
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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeSat Jun 14, 2014 10:49 pm

@B440 wrote:
@redlinemotorsportts wrote:
Dooood- my goodness? I think ive lost track! I think this has turned into a 4x4x4x4x4... or sooner or later it will. Bahaha, that flat head is a great engine.

lol. Yeah I think I have more than enough parts now. I may even have enough to continue the project, and fix up the Turf Master into a like-new lawn cutter. The only thing I don't have enough of.... is time to work on it.

What would you make with four steerable axles?
Id make a 4x4 mower.. and have the rest for spare axles incase a knuckle breaks or something. Ive seen people use MST axles with AWS knuckles fixed to the MST axles, just using the AWS transaxle half shafts-much stronger axle. Puppetkicker on youtube did that for his 4x4 craftsman mud mower.

But back to what i was saying, 2 AWS axles for offroading or something, so you could turn tight and crab walk, that would be so cool. Maybe a racing mower for 4x4 launches or something. up to you.

_______________________________________________
Check out my builds!: MTD "Rock Bouncing" Mower -------- 60's Springfeild V-twin Mini Speed Tractor : SOLD!
Project 4x4x4 Screen17
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richie thomas
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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeSun Jun 15, 2014 12:31 am

@redlinemotorsportts wrote:
@B440 wrote:
@redlinemotorsportts wrote:
Dooood- my goodness? I think ive lost track! I think this has turned into a 4x4x4x4x4... or sooner or later it will. Bahaha, that flat head is a great engine.

lol. Yeah I think I have more than enough parts now. I may even have enough to continue the project, and fix up the Turf Master into a like-new lawn cutter. The only thing I don't have enough of.... is time to work on it.

What would you make with four steerable axles?
Id make a 4x4 mower.. and have the rest for spare axles incase a knuckle breaks or something. Ive seen people use MST axles with AWS knuckles fixed to the MST axles, just using the AWS transaxle half shafts-much stronger axle. Puppetkicker on youtube did that for his 4x4 craftsman mud mower.

But back to what i was saying, 2 AWS axles for offroading or something, so you could turn tight and crab walk, that would be so cool. Maybe a racing mower for 4x4 launches or something. up to you.
make it a lowered racer with 2 aws and it could be like the car on fast 6

_______________________________________________
if it has wheels and a motor its meant to mod  Twisted Evil
check out my builds
https://www.atltf.com/t1862-lifted-craftsman Smile
https://www.atltf.com/t3159-richies-mudracer
mini deuce

and my youtube channel
https://www.youtube.com/user/wildpanthercutlery
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B440
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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeTue Jun 17, 2014 11:03 pm

I finally took the motor off. I had a hell of a time removing the drive pulley. I ended up flipping the tractor over and cutting it off.

 scratch So I thought I took a pic of the motor removed, but I guess not. This shot of the Briggs V-twin that I'm going to use will have to do. confused 
Project 4x4x4 IMG_1931_zpse0532d45

It looks like it should bolt right in. I just placed it there to get an idea of the size. It seems bigger, but it's definitely lighter than the opposed twin.

I've also been researching the Noma models and it appears that some of the deluxe models had a hydrostatic transaxle and a Vanguard V-twin. The V-twin will happen on mine, even if I have to drill mounting points. The hydro axles though, may not. I can always upgrade to the hydros at a later time.
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1997 Murray
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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeWed Jun 18, 2014 10:40 am

I like manuals better than hydros. my dads hydro burned up esily, sooner than an mtd. (I've broke about 4 mtds) and you cant speed them up much.
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jonnya
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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeMon Aug 25, 2014 11:33 am

I didn't realise they even made AWS ride on mowers. Maybe they just don't have them here in the UK. I like the idea. Did you see the fella on youtube who has made a skid steer 6 x 6 wheelhorse?
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B440
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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeMon Aug 25, 2014 8:52 pm

Seen the 6x6. Pretty neat.
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willis923
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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeMon Aug 25, 2014 8:56 pm

Project 4x4x4 236argo_zps50d6d010

beat that! 8x8.. lol

_______________________________________________
-1974 bolens 1055 (Rolling Thunder)
-1989 Craftsman GT6000 (Blockhead)
-2004 Ford F-250 super duty FX4
-1999 Ford F-350 Superduty 4x4 7.3 Powerstroke


Lt wrote:
Feel free to try... Dont let anything but fear and common sense stop you. 


Project 4x4x4 Pbucket

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B440
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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeMon Aug 25, 2014 9:10 pm

I see your 8x8 and raise you 10x10 geek

Project 4x4x4 1035219620X310
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willis923
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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeTue Aug 26, 2014 12:14 am

@B440 wrote:
I see your 8x8 and raise you 10x10 geek

but do you have access to it?

_______________________________________________
-1974 bolens 1055 (Rolling Thunder)
-1989 Craftsman GT6000 (Blockhead)
-2004 Ford F-250 super duty FX4
-1999 Ford F-350 Superduty 4x4 7.3 Powerstroke


Lt wrote:
Feel free to try... Dont let anything but fear and common sense stop you. 


Project 4x4x4 Pbucket

Chat moderator

1st Lieutenant, Volunteer Firefighter, EMT-B, Galway Vol Fire co. Galway NY
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redlinemotorsportts
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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeSat Nov 08, 2014 5:03 pm

Whats going on with this? I mean, if youre gunna hoard all the rare aws axles, you should make something... Bahaha, im joking. Just....curious

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Check out my builds!: MTD "Rock Bouncing" Mower -------- 60's Springfeild V-twin Mini Speed Tractor : SOLD!
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B440
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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeSat Nov 08, 2014 7:25 pm

lol yes, I should. This project is way down on the "to-do" list though. This project doesn't make me money or really serve a purpose other than to satisfy my curiosity with designing a machine that drives and steers all wheels.

Right now I'm getting my snowblower ready. It needed the skids and a spring replaced. Had some bad gas in it too.

Hoarding, heh heh. I suppose it's not really hoarding as all the steering parts are NLA, so if I break anything, I'm SOL unless I keep spares. I had my eye on another Noma mower for $150. I should stop... really.
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PostSubject: Re: Project 4x4x4   Project 4x4x4 Icon_minitimeSat Nov 08, 2014 10:46 pm

@B440 wrote:
lol yes, I should. This project is way down on the "to-do" list though. This project doesn't make me money or really serve a purpose other than to satisfy my curiosity with designing a machine that drives and steers all wheels.

Right now I'm getting my snowblower ready. It needed the skids and a spring replaced. Had some bad gas in it too.

Hoarding, heh heh. I suppose it's not really hoarding as all the steering parts are NLA, so if I break anything, I'm SOL unless I keep spares. I had my eye on another Noma mower for $150. I should stop... really.
You can make your money back on that you know. Guess that's only if you just want the rest of the tractor

_______________________________________________
Check out my builds!: MTD "Rock Bouncing" Mower -------- 60's Springfeild V-twin Mini Speed Tractor : SOLD!
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