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 My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)

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802 Customs
redzz02
Craftsman1998
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MatthewD
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1997 Murray
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 2nd 2015, 10:44 am

This is my entry for this year's build-off, AND IT WILL be better than last year's. It will have removeable wheelie bars for pulling, and a pin-on rack on the back to carry stuff such as a cooler and gas cans. The front will have a bumper that is removeable, and with the racks removed it should look like a a-c D19 tractor. It has a 7hp brigs that I will try to get to run on diesel, and if I can find one, a briggs opposed. winch is planed on, along with 17" front ags and 26x12x12 ags for the rear.

My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Build-10

My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Build-11
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ZSmachines
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 2nd 2015, 11:08 am

Hmm... I definitely want to know how to convert a briggs to diesel!
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MatthewD
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 2nd 2015, 11:54 am

Why do you have two build off entries?
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ZSmachines
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 2nd 2015, 11:58 am

Because why noT build two if you can? I'm pretty sure the rules say you can!
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MatthewD
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 2nd 2015, 12:32 pm

Yeah right okay. I personally wouldn`t have time.
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MasonMcK
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 2nd 2015, 1:23 pm

Yes you are allowed to have two builds in the build off. I might start another project later on in the build if I have time.

How are you planning to get the Briggs to run on diesel? Are you just going to have the spark plugs ignite the diesel or are you planning on raising the compression somehow and changing it to fuel injection? Either way I can't wait to see the outcome.
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MatthewD
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 2nd 2015, 1:33 pm

MasonMcK wrote:
Yes you are allowed to have two builds in the build off. I might start another project later on in the build if I have time.

How are you planning to get the Briggs to run on diesel? Are you just going to have the spark plugs ignite the diesel or are you planning on raising the compression somehow and changing it to fuel injection? Either way I can't wait to see the outcome.
If you put a few more head gaskets on and lower the compression, I`ve heard that you can get it to run on diesel
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 2nd 2015, 1:56 pm

MatthewD wrote:

If you put a few more head gaskets on and lower the compression, I`ve heard that you can get it to run on diesel

Diesel requires a higher compression ratio so if extra head gaskets lowers the comp ratio then it won't run. Unless you meant extra gaskets raise the compression ratio. I'll look into it some more. I'm definitely interested in this.
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MatthewD
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 2nd 2015, 3:09 pm

MasonMcK wrote:
MatthewD wrote:

If you put a few more head gaskets on and lower the compression, I`ve heard that you can get it to run on diesel

Diesel requires a higher compression ratio so if extra head gaskets lowers the comp ratio then it won't run. Unless you meant extra gaskets raise the compression ratio. I'll look into it some more. I'm definitely interested in this.
I know but I read it in this thread that a petrol engine will run on kerosene, bad gas or diesel if you lower the compression

https://www.atltf.com/t3719-run-a-lawn-mower-off-old-engine-oil-diesel-bad-gas-kerosene
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1997 Murray
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 2nd 2015, 3:15 pm

yeah that is what I am doing, I am going to work on it today if Doc approves it. My uncle called today and said that he has a blade for it!
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MasonMcK
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 2nd 2015, 5:01 pm

MatthewD wrote:

I know but I read it in this thread that a petrol engine will run on kerosene, bad gas or diesel if you lower the compression

https://www.atltf.com/t3719-run-a-lawn-mower-off-old-engine-oil-diesel-bad-gas-kerosene

Ok I get why you would want to lower the compression ratio now. One so the block will not have as much stress placed upon its moving parts due to the higher compression, but also because the higher compression ratio is not needed since the engine will still be using spark plugs. I had interpreted what you had said as a full gas-diesel conversion, not just running diesel in it.

My apologies. I am still quite interested in how well this will work.
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MatthewD
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 2nd 2015, 5:13 pm

MasonMcK wrote:
MatthewD wrote:

I know but I read it in this thread that a petrol engine will run on kerosene, bad gas or diesel if you lower the compression

https://www.atltf.com/t3719-run-a-lawn-mower-off-old-engine-oil-diesel-bad-gas-kerosene

Ok I get why you would want to lower the compression ratio now. One so the block will not have as much stress placed upon its moving parts due to the higher compression, but also because the higher compression ratio is not needed since the engine will still be using spark plugs. I had interpreted what you had said as a full gas-diesel conversion, not just running diesel in it.

My apologies. I am still quite interested in how well this will work.
No you`re okay Wink I think you may have some power loss though
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 2nd 2015, 7:24 pm

I've been all over the 'net, starting with that thread you linked to, on running gasser engines on Kero or Diesel. Its not at all practical, but a cool proof-of-concept. Happy building!
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 2nd 2015, 8:08 pm

My dad ran his farmall super A on kerosene. there was a snow storm and we couldnt get gas but we had tons of kerosene so we dumped in 5 gallons. cranked it over and it fired up and we pulled sleds around the yard with it. was pretty neat ran weak though.
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1997 Murray
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 2nd 2015, 9:09 pm

Thanks Doc. I am trying to get spark, and even with the automotive coil, it won't work. I will get it running on gas first and then diesel. I ran the landlord on half gas and half kero, but it has to crank for a long time to start up, and it won't run as fast.
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 2nd 2015, 9:48 pm

Maybe have a small tank for gas and full size one for diesel. You could T the lines together with a shut off for each one. Diesel in a gas engine smokes quite a bit, which means a lot of unburned fuel. Not that I know too much about diesel stuff, but maybe you could get it to burn more completely with lower compression if you ran the engine really hot or something. Like smokey yunicks 1980's hot air engine. Might be able to experiment with ignition timing and stuff too and get it to work better.
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 2nd 2015, 11:35 pm

Goodluck with the conversion!!!
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1997 Murray
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 3rd 2015, 10:35 am

mr.modified wrote:
Maybe have a small tank for gas and full size one for diesel. You could T the lines together with a shut off for each one. Diesel in a gas engine smokes quite a bit, which means a lot of unburned fuel. Not that I know too much about diesel stuff, but maybe you could get it to burn more completely with lower compression if you ran the engine really hot or something. Like smokey yunicks 1980's hot air engine. Might be able to experiment with ignition timing and stuff too and get it to work better.

That is what I am thinking. I think if I wrap a copper tube around the exhaust for the diesel through to heat it up. Got an atv carb mounted, still no spark.

My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Build-14

My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Build-15
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 3rd 2015, 12:48 pm

1997 Murray wrote:
mr.modified wrote:
Maybe have a small tank for gas and full size one for diesel. You could T the lines together with a shut off for each one. Diesel in a gas engine smokes quite a bit, which means a lot of unburned fuel. Not that I know too much about diesel stuff, but maybe you could get it to burn more completely with lower compression if you ran the engine really hot or something. Like smokey yunicks 1980's hot air engine. Might be able to experiment with ignition timing and stuff too and get it to work better.

That is what I am thinking. I think if I wrap a copper tube around the exhaust for the diesel through to heat it up. Got an atv carb mounted, still no spark.

My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Build-14

My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Build-15
I`m gonna be following this build, it is quite a good idea for sure! If this works I may convert my 12hp Briggs to diesel.
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802 Customs
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 3rd 2015, 6:03 pm

I just commented on matthew D's post about how its not practical, reliable or really possible to convert a gas engine to diesel. Check it out if you want. It was engineered to run on gas and the novelty of having a diesel isn't really worth it.
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 3rd 2015, 6:14 pm

Yeah I know, just doing it so I can tell all the unintellegent kids at the pull that I have a deisel. Farmall did it, so I think I can.
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1997 Murray
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 3rd 2015, 8:29 pm

I got the engine started, needed a condenser. It is the first time it has fired in 35 years, and it only seems to run at idle, so it still needs some work. Made a vid: https://youtu.be/NldSS9vjY9Q

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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 3rd 2015, 9:21 pm

802 Customs wrote:
I just commented on matthew D's post about how its not practical, reliable or really possible to convert a gas engine to diesel. Check it out if you want. It was engineered to run on gas and the novelty of having a diesel isn't really worth it.

Yeah but the challenge of getting it to work on diesel when it isn't supposed to! Something like that anyway...
I thought of a couple things I forgot to mention, such as...once the engine is warmed up and running on diesel, you won't be able to just shut it off with the key/shutting off the spark. It will keep running on it's own, so you have to either stop the fuel flow or block off air intake. I remembered that I tried running one on diesel one time. I didn't modify it, just ran it. If you have a fuel shut off, that would stop it, but not right away due to what's left in the float bowl. The other thing is that I think diesel fuel is tough on rubber fuel lines and gaskets meant for gas. That wouldn't be much of an issue if you switched to gas with a separate tank before shut down though. I guess diesel probably burns much slower, so a lot more ignition advance would be possible, but since the one I tried ran without spark at all even with a low compression gas engine, not sure how advanced ignition timing would work. I guess It would still ignite the mixture earlier. Maybe with pre-heating, a somewhat lean mixture, and advancing the spark a little, it wouldn't run too bad. Better than just dumping diesel in a stock engine anyway. Would be neat to try it.
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1997 Murray
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 4th 2015, 10:37 am

I have been running the landlord on kerosene (similar to diesel) and it did not want to start. here is a pic of it blowing smoke:

My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Build-16

here is a pic of the tractor, I am getting ags for it tonight. got a blade for it last night.

My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Build-17
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitimeFebruary 4th 2015, 11:35 am

I wonder if a throttle body from an old 90s car would work as an air shut off...
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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Empty
PostSubject: Re: My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)    My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)  Icon_minitime

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My 1962 Simplicity 700 PTM (Pulling Trail Machine)
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