All-Terrain Lawn Tractor Forum
Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

All-Terrain Lawn Tractor Forum

Like riding lawn tractors through mud, woods, rocks, and snow? Then this is the place for you! Share your ideas, Post your projects and more!
 
EventsPortalHomeSite RulesFAQSearchRegisterLog inBuild-Off
Welcome to the All-Terrain Lawn Tractor Forum!

 

 Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.

Go down 
+6
LAWN MOWER MUDDER
Angchor
83ratrodmurray
Doc Sprocket
CornShuck4CE
Stretch44875
10 posters
Go to page : 1, 2  Next
AuthorMessage
Stretch44875
Administrator
Stretch44875
Administrator

500+ Posts
500+ Posts

Age : 50
Join date : 2012-04-05
Points : 5723
Posts : 959
Location : Mansfield, Ohio

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeApril 10th 2014, 9:17 pm

Video of us locking up a 820 the cheap way.  Need someone to go romp this design, and see what happens! If it was to fail, it would stay inside the diff, and not ruin the rest of the transaxle.

/watch?v=cPnbZMGJucU
Back to top Go down
CornShuck4CE
Member
CornShuck4CE
Member


Age : 35
Join date : 2014-04-07
Points : 4258
Posts : 337
Location : Woodville Al

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeApril 14th 2014, 3:19 pm

Anybody know where i can get some spider gears for my 820 or could i buy some from someone 820 are hard to find where i live.
Back to top Go down
Stretch44875
Administrator
Stretch44875
Administrator

500+ Posts
500+ Posts

Age : 50
Join date : 2012-04-05
Points : 5723
Posts : 959
Location : Mansfield, Ohio

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeApril 14th 2014, 3:51 pm

I've got a couple extra sets. 15.00 plus shipping.
Back to top Go down
Doc Sprocket
Site VIP
Doc Sprocket
Site VIP

2500+ Posts
2500+ Posts!
2018 Build-Off Entrant
2018 Build-Off Entrant
2021 Winner of Winners
2021 Winner of Winners
1st Place Build-Off 2016
1st Place Build-Off Winner 2016

Age : 51
Join date : 2013-04-21
Points : 7340
Posts : 2914
Location : Ontario Canada

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeApril 14th 2014, 5:47 pm

Well done. Good, cheap, weld-free solutions are always appealing and especially useful to those just starting out!
Back to top Go down
83ratrodmurray
Member
83ratrodmurray
Member


Age : 29
Join date : 2013-07-05
Points : 4314
Posts : 94
Location : Kentucky

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeApril 14th 2014, 8:32 pm

neat idea.
Back to top Go down
CornShuck4CE
Member
CornShuck4CE
Member


Age : 35
Join date : 2014-04-07
Points : 4258
Posts : 337
Location : Woodville Al

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeApril 14th 2014, 8:59 pm

Ight den be da shippin to come alabamal. A flat rate USPS. Couple bucks or so. Do i need to pm you or email. With adress how at work.
Back to top Go down
CornShuck4CE
Member
CornShuck4CE
Member


Age : 35
Join date : 2014-04-07
Points : 4258
Posts : 337
Location : Woodville Al

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeApril 14th 2014, 9:01 pm

Iv welded several transaxels. But for some reason i cant bring myself to weld this one. Id like to by the locker but i aint got 80 bucks layen around.
Back to top Go down
Stretch44875
Administrator
Stretch44875
Administrator

500+ Posts
500+ Posts

Age : 50
Join date : 2012-04-05
Points : 5723
Posts : 959
Location : Mansfield, Ohio

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeApril 15th 2014, 6:15 am

Pm is fine.
Back to top Go down
Angchor
Member
Angchor
Member


Age : 67
Join date : 2014-04-14
Points : 4441
Posts : 491
Location : Index, Washington

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeAugust 6th 2014, 1:13 pm

Is it possible to put 4 extra gears in there, instead of just the two extra?

Seems to me that it would be stronger and less prone to breakage, if you could somehow work them into there.
Back to top Go down
CornShuck4CE
Member
CornShuck4CE
Member


Age : 35
Join date : 2014-04-07
Points : 4258
Posts : 337
Location : Woodville Al

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeAugust 6th 2014, 3:12 pm

I think you could get 2 more in ther (4 in all). Your right would be stronger. I did this style locker in my 820 still goin strong. But i do notice a lil slack in the diff 4 gears wouldent chang that. The only way to get rid of all the slack would be to dock lock it or solid axel. But this is a good fast an cheap salution for someone with no welder or just startin out.
Back to top Go down
LAWN MOWER MUDDER
Established Member
LAWN MOWER MUDDER
Established Member

500+ Posts
500+ Posts
2014 Build-Off Top 3 Winner
2014 Build-Off Top 3 Winner

Age : 24
Join date : 2013-04-08
Points : 5231
Posts : 913
Location : Central Pa

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeAugust 6th 2014, 4:03 pm

CornShuck4CE wrote:
I think you could get 2 more in ther (4 in all). Your right would be stronger. I did this style locker in my 820 still goin strong. But i do notice a lil slack in the diff 4 gears wouldent chang that. The only way to get rid of all the slack would be to dock lock it or solid axel. But this is a good fast an cheap salution for someone with no welder or just startin out.

CornShuck, you can always weld the locker spiders together. They wouldn't be bearing the load of just welding them to the pin.  What I mean is weld the two additional spiders to the original spiders then that may take up some slack and you won't have to worry about cracking them.  

BTW, Doc-Lockers also requires strong welds. two pins welded to a shaft. Those welds probably hold more than the welds on the regular pin style. Those welds practically hold your final drive together.  IF your welds on a pin style break you still have a sorta differential, depending on how she blows.  With a Doc-Locker you loose those pins and your mode of transportation is done. Maybe I'm wrong idk lol.
Back to top Go down
CornShuck4CE
Member
CornShuck4CE
Member


Age : 35
Join date : 2014-04-07
Points : 4258
Posts : 337
Location : Woodville Al

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeAugust 6th 2014, 4:34 pm

The problem iv had with welding the diff aint the weld braking its the gear itself breaking. Heating the gear changes the structure of the metal gear causing it to be mor brittle. The axel of a doc lock and pin is a difforent metal structure than the gear. Those welds be it as good as any other still makes the two metals act difforent. 
Thanks LMM i may be wrong but thats where my proplem lyes.
Back to top Go down
Doc Sprocket
Site VIP
Doc Sprocket
Site VIP

2500+ Posts
2500+ Posts!
2018 Build-Off Entrant
2018 Build-Off Entrant
2021 Winner of Winners
2021 Winner of Winners
1st Place Build-Off 2016
1st Place Build-Off Winner 2016

Age : 51
Join date : 2013-04-21
Points : 7340
Posts : 2914
Location : Ontario Canada

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeAugust 6th 2014, 7:02 pm

CornShuck4CE wrote:
The problem iv had with welding the diff aint the weld braking its the gear itself breaking. Heating the gear changes the structure of the metal gear causing it to be mor brittle. The axel of a doc lock and pin is a difforent metal structure than the gear. Those welds be it as good as any other still makes the two metals act difforent. 
Thanks LMM i may be wrong but thats where my proplem lyes.

True, PLUS- Keep in mind that the reason that welded diffs often fail, is the fact that you're not even dealing with standard, forged, mild steel. MOST diff gears are made from sintered steel. It is a manufacturing process that comes out far cheaper to produce, but sintered does not weld very well. Basically, instead of steel being melted down, forged (or cast) and then machined to spec, it is instead powdered, and then pressed into a mold of the finished product. The end result welds quite crappily. Not because you can't melt it, but because when you DO melt it, the melt is adjacent to more powdered poo. It's the dissimilarity that tends to be the failure point.

LAWN MOWER MUDDER wrote:


BTW, Doc-Lockers also requires strong welds. two pins welded to a shaft. Those welds probably hold more than the welds on the regular pin style. Those welds practically hold your final drive together.  IF your welds on a pin style break you still have a sorta differential, depending on how she blows.  With a Doc-Locker you loose those pins and your mode of transportation is done. Maybe I'm wrong idk lol. [/color]
Also true. You're zapping 5/8" to 3/4". You need a strong machine, and some skill as a welder. Like other "alternate" locking methods (the Zinc Locker comes to mind), it's not for everyone. It IS preferable to welding spiders though. I've been beating it like it owes me money, and it continues to hold.
Back to top Go down
Moose
Established Member
Moose
Established Member

500+ Posts
500+ Posts

Age : 35
Join date : 2014-01-12
Points : 4973
Posts : 919
Location : Defiance, Ohio

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeAugust 7th 2014, 12:48 am

Gotta say I am a fan of the double broached straight axle idea someone had a while back. I just got a straight axle 820 haven't cracked it open but pretty sure it's broached.
Back to top Go down
redlinemotorsportts
Moderator
redlinemotorsportts
Moderator

2500+ Posts
2500+ Posts!
2014 Build-Off Entrant
2014 Build-Off Entrant

Age : 27
Join date : 2013-03-18
Points : 7505
Posts : 3131
Location : raleigh nc

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeAugust 7th 2014, 1:10 am

Doc Sprocket wrote:
CornShuck4CE wrote:
The problem iv had with welding the diff aint the weld braking its the gear itself breaking. Heating the gear changes the structure of the metal gear causing it to be mor brittle. The axel of a doc lock and pin is a difforent metal structure than the gear. Those welds be it as good as any other still makes the two metals act difforent. 
Thanks LMM i may be wrong but thats where my proplem lyes.

True, PLUS- Keep in mind that the reason that welded diffs often fail, is the fact that you're not even dealing with standard, forged, mild steel. MOST diff gears are made from sintered steel. It is a manufacturing process that comes out far cheaper to produce, but sintered does not weld very well. Basically, instead of steel being melted down, forged (or cast) and then machined to spec, it is instead powdered, and then pressed into a mold of the finished product. The end result welds quite crappily.

I think the pins itself are made from sintered steel, not the gears, but i could be wrong.

Heres what it looks like broken, not on the weld, but the heated, brittle material right next to the weld. Foote axle:


Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. 15011210
Back to top Go down
Moose
Established Member
Moose
Established Member

500+ Posts
500+ Posts

Age : 35
Join date : 2014-01-12
Points : 4973
Posts : 919
Location : Defiance, Ohio

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeAugust 7th 2014, 10:37 am

one way around that would be getting them heated up and rehardened if you want to alleviate some of the stress
Back to top Go down
Doc Sprocket
Site VIP
Doc Sprocket
Site VIP

2500+ Posts
2500+ Posts!
2018 Build-Off Entrant
2018 Build-Off Entrant
2021 Winner of Winners
2021 Winner of Winners
1st Place Build-Off 2016
1st Place Build-Off Winner 2016

Age : 51
Join date : 2013-04-21
Points : 7340
Posts : 2914
Location : Ontario Canada

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeAugust 7th 2014, 5:14 pm

Moose wrote:
one way around that would be getting them heated up and rehardened if you want to alleviate some of the stress

If we're still talking about sintered parts, then no.
Back to top Go down
Stretch44875
Administrator
Stretch44875
Administrator

500+ Posts
500+ Posts

Age : 50
Join date : 2012-04-05
Points : 5723
Posts : 959
Location : Mansfield, Ohio

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeAugust 9th 2014, 10:23 am

Boring, broaching keyways, and using a straight axle is what we do, and is unbreakable. This method is a cheap and easy way to lock.
Back to top Go down
Angchor
Member
Angchor
Member


Age : 67
Join date : 2014-04-14
Points : 4441
Posts : 491
Location : Index, Washington

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeAugust 9th 2014, 11:15 am

Stretch44875 wrote:
Boring, broaching keyways, and using a straight axle is what we do, and is unbreakable.  This method is a cheap and easy way to lock.

Is there a nice pictorial of this in detail somewhere?
Back to top Go down
Stretch44875
Administrator
Stretch44875
Administrator

500+ Posts
500+ Posts

Age : 50
Join date : 2012-04-05
Points : 5723
Posts : 959
Location : Mansfield, Ohio

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeAugust 11th 2014, 8:43 am

I'd check our build threads, some pics in there. Also have a video of the transaxle that shows it.

Back to top Go down
Angchor
Member
Angchor
Member


Age : 67
Join date : 2014-04-14
Points : 4441
Posts : 491
Location : Index, Washington

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeAugust 11th 2014, 11:59 am

Stretch44875 wrote:
I'd check our build threads, some pics in there.  Also have a video of the transaxle that shows it.

Thank you. That explained it pretty good!

I am subscribed. I guess I should spend more time having a look. LOL
Back to top Go down
Ariens YT11
Established Member
Ariens YT11
Established Member

500+ Posts
500+ Posts
2014 Build-Off Entrant
2014 Build-Off Entrant
2015 Build-Off Entrant
2015 Build-Off Entrant

Age : 27
Join date : 2012-10-31
Points : 5186
Posts : 745
Location : The Wyo-Braska Panhandle

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeAugust 11th 2014, 2:58 pm

Strech, do you have any idea on why only 5 will not engage all the way on the 820's?
Back to top Go down
LAWN MOWER MUDDER
Established Member
LAWN MOWER MUDDER
Established Member

500+ Posts
500+ Posts
2014 Build-Off Top 3 Winner
2014 Build-Off Top 3 Winner

Age : 24
Join date : 2013-04-08
Points : 5231
Posts : 913
Location : Central Pa

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeAugust 11th 2014, 4:18 pm

Ariens YT11 wrote:
Strech, do you have any idea on why only 5 will not engage all the way on the 820's?

Shift keys?
Back to top Go down
Ariens YT11
Established Member
Ariens YT11
Established Member

500+ Posts
500+ Posts
2014 Build-Off Entrant
2014 Build-Off Entrant
2015 Build-Off Entrant
2015 Build-Off Entrant

Age : 27
Join date : 2012-10-31
Points : 5186
Posts : 745
Location : The Wyo-Braska Panhandle

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeAugust 11th 2014, 4:56 pm

LAWN MOWER MUDDER wrote:
Ariens YT11 wrote:
Strech, do you have any idea on why only 5 will not engage all the way on the 820's?

Shift keys?

I'm thinking something is bent inside but I don't want to tear into it yet.
Back to top Go down
jsisti845
Member
jsisti845
Member


Join date : 2013-09-26
Points : 4213
Posts : 88

Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitimeAugust 11th 2014, 10:06 pm

could be a problem with shift linkage
Back to top Go down
Sponsored content





Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Empty
PostSubject: Re: Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.   Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears. Icon_minitime

Back to top Go down
 
Lock a 820 peerless with spider gears.
Back to top 
Page 1 of 2Go to page : 1, 2  Next
 Similar topics
-
» Peerless 600 "diff lock"
» Dana Spicer hardened gears.
» A noob question, but how do you actually shift gears on a mower?
» Best type of grease for gearbox?
» transmission gears wrong

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
All-Terrain Lawn Tractor Forum :: Technical Forum :: Drivetrain & Brake Tech :: Transaxles and Transmissions-
Jump to: